Author Topic: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?  (Read 5818 times)

Offline azarimy

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So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« on: December 30, 2006, 03:35:33 AM »
after letting this forum run for a semester, i'm wondering where is it actually going? it's fast becoming the house for specific group of people rather than a shared user space/community. the design school of thought forum is created so that people of various different levels could have a discussion on specific topic(s) of interest. moreover, the discussion could be sustained over a long period of time, especially if the issue is contemporary.

i would like to know where do u people plan to take this forum? if it's a discussion for a specific batch of 2nd year diploma students, then it should be in the subcommunities forum. as we understand it, the curriculum of diploma now is still based on the original diploma curriculum. 2nd years should be involved in a more elaborate discussion on specific topic, issue or paradigm given by the tutors. previously, it has been conducted using the workbase system. as i understand it, they did not use the workbase system, but the pedagogy remains the same.

if this is the case, i find this forum redundant.

future implications:

if this type of forum remains, future discussions will require several more expanded topics/forum/rooms that focuses on the specific group of people. moreover, remaining forum will not be put to good use and would have gone to waste. what say u?
what gets us into trouble is not what we dont know. it's what we know for sure that just ain't so - mark twain

Awan_Larat

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #1 on: December 31, 2006, 09:25:13 PM »
In simple words AZA, our Philosophy is Practicing Good Architecture, while we don't have specific sectarian Design School of Thought, our studio resembles to what they are practicing in UiTM (since we have the max 33students/5 design lecturers per studio only). You are right as the web manager here, Let the students decide where they wanna be, i wont set any foot for this decision, its their forum anyway.

However,
While, i think all the Design School of Thoughts are not directly pedagogies, more to conduct and sectarian belief(to what they evolve), all DSCT should follow the Design MATRIX. What use of DSCT when you don't follow the Matrix?. 
« Last Edit: December 31, 2006, 09:36:05 PM by Awan_Larat »

Offline doctor_cox

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2006, 10:55:46 PM »
actually, you may have a point. segregating scholarly discussion to specific sub forum isolates it from ppl like me who ignore the sub community forum.

Offline Yuki_Onna

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2007, 01:56:24 AM »
y not make it a forum for the DIPLOMA students instead of just the 2nd years?? what i'm saying is, different from the subcomm, this forum is for those studying in UTM KL taking our diploma. means this forums is for the juniors and future juniors to come....... since we can't spacify ourselves in any other catagory in the design school of thought, i think we need this forum........

I atually like it that we have a forum outside of our subcomm, so that we can discuss our works and all. i dunno bout the others though........
"Seeing is not believing; believing IS seeing..."

\(^-^)/ Joyce
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Offline lyceum

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2007, 02:19:32 PM »
Sounds like a much better solution Yuki. We'll see to it.
"Resistance is futile! Your posterior shall be violated!!"

Awan_Larat

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2007, 10:45:12 PM »
We are about to have 3rd Years next sem...sounds like a good plan...Aza?
There's myself, Kay, Hazel..

Column DIPLOMA.
Three Parts, 1st Year, 2nd Year and 3rd Year, no specific School of Thought, just Practicing Good Architecture...
« Last Edit: February 16, 2007, 10:46:59 PM by Awan_Larat »

Offline pyan

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2007, 04:11:39 AM »
no specific School of Thought, just Practicing Good Architecture...

i object to that subject title! might as well go ahead and call it, practising yuri's architecture..
dumb di dumb di dumb..

Awan_Larat

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2007, 04:13:43 AM »
woit!!!...its not all me alone ler...siut le ngkao Pyan!!!!!

Offline azarimy

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2007, 04:19:39 AM »
that's  the thing. why doesnt anything u taught in UTM diploma fit into the current design school of thoughts?

the reason i've started the school of thoughts was to create a topical discussion that should more or less cover most parts of architectural studies. looking at several UK curriculum, i believe that most of THEIR discussions could be categorized in atleast one school of thought.

so now UTM diploma says they have a different 'thing'. i fail to see how it couldnt fit into the others.
what gets us into trouble is not what we dont know. it's what we know for sure that just ain't so - mark twain

Awan_Larat

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2007, 04:25:23 AM »
But it's not ethical, more over to marginalized KL. Does not having a school of thought, a bad thing? Maybe the categorization and generalization is the problem. But what of UiTM, they are equally good without a school of thought?

i've said this before, maybe we do tend 'to spread butter too thin on a piece of bread'... do remember, the Architect who suggested 'School of Thought Systems' is in KL. I've read his paper found in a stacks  of old journals.

« Last Edit: February 17, 2007, 04:31:31 AM by Awan_Larat »

Offline azarimy

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2007, 04:36:58 AM »
are u thick?

have u not read what i wrote?

the reason i've started the school of thoughts was to create a topical discussion that should more or less cover most parts of architectural studies. looking at several UK curriculum, i believe that most of THEIR discussions could be categorized in atleast one school of thought.

the school of thoughts are a category of discussion in TANGGAM. if u're doing 1st year stuff, u can fit it either in fundamental, or a new category probably called 'Interior Design' or something. everything can fit somewhere. the reason i asked about this category is bcoz i believe anything discussed under it could fit in atleast one of the school of thoughts.

dont tell me u're teaching urban, social, vernacular, environmental (and etc) to different students in one studio? r u saying each student is approaching different things under you?
what gets us into trouble is not what we dont know. it's what we know for sure that just ain't so - mark twain

Awan_Larat

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2007, 04:49:47 AM »
Quote
dont tell me u're teaching urban, social, vernacular, environmental (and etc) to different students in one studio? r u saying each student is approaching different things under you?

Why not? Ehhh...you are under Bryan Lawson kan? Do you really think this is wrong? In approach to teaching design? Who says what we have is eternally right?

If you are able to make INTERIOR DESIGN 'column' for LUCT why double standard us here in KL? I am pissed right now AZA, you are complicating a request just because it does not fit a certain kind of 'BRANDING' in Tanggam. This is not FREE share of knowledge.

Sigh...just do whatever you like, its beyond argument already, for i foresee the decision has been made.
Maybe UTM KL need to open their own Community Forum if we can't be here.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2007, 05:05:24 AM by Awan_Larat »

Offline azarimy

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2007, 05:16:21 AM »
i'd somehow rather listen to yuki's proposal which makes more sense to me.

i'm not complicating a request. ur asking to have a separate column that in the end would be inhabited by UTM KL people only, whereas they wont feel the need to get out of their own column. it's not about ownership, its about how the entire tanggam should be accessible and be used by every member.

what u want to have is a STUDENT SPECIFIC column.

what i want to have is a DISCUSSION ORIENTED column.


tak paham ke apa?
what gets us into trouble is not what we dont know. it's what we know for sure that just ain't so - mark twain

Offline pyan

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2007, 05:24:00 AM »
i thought the diploma course was to provide drafts people..sume nak jadik akitek, sape nak mendrafting?
dumb di dumb di dumb..

Awan_Larat

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2007, 05:25:03 AM »
GOSH AZA... never curb to what's going to happen therefore don't allowed it...What are you afraid of? The student will flood other columns, you will give opinions in here, the rest too...isn't that what we do in here AZA? I am merely extending Yuki's Proposal...

Paham sangat ngan abang AZA oi...


Awan_Larat

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2007, 05:27:54 AM »
i thought the diploma course was to provide drafts people..sume nak jadik akitek, sape nak mendrafting?

Dude, take that back!!! don't mock them...You are disrespecting me and them. There is not one way of becoming an Architect. You, me and even AZA took that path...

 

Awan_Larat

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #16 on: February 17, 2007, 05:41:16 AM »

Why does you've guys only have a prefix mind of achieving the same goals! Not one way of doing it.

Offline pyan

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #17 on: February 17, 2007, 02:17:33 PM »
im not mocking them yuri, but u have to understand, dulu to be a graduate architect from utm there was only a singular programme, u had to enter the diploma course first as a pre requisite before entering the degree course. so the end objective was to train architects.

but now, there are 2 seperate programs, the diploma route and the degree route which 'should' actuallly cater to 2 different, but equally important, aspects of of the architectural profession.

the diploma course is no longer an integral part of the degree course as it was before. therefore i think to actually perform ur job well, u should first have in ur mind, to train people who could communicate well with their drawings. so when they do go out into the professional field, they are'nt seen as half baked graduate architects, but actually proficient people who can do the job as draftsmen, which was what the diploma course was set up to do. different to that of the degree course, which is actually to produce graduate architects. totally two different things.

look, if u really wanted to train future architects, u should actually be in jb.the quota for diploma holders to actually enter the degree course ada baper? 5-10 people maybe? so its fine for them to enter either the 2nd or 3rd year level of the degree course, and decide to become architects, but the rest? u have to equipt them for what they are actually qualified for on paper.

ko ada amanah yuri to provide draftsmen, not architects, dont let the profession down. so are you doing your job?
« Last Edit: February 17, 2007, 04:49:35 PM by pyan »
dumb di dumb di dumb..

Offline lyceum

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #18 on: February 17, 2007, 04:03:10 PM »
Actually, what is the objective of the current Diploma porgramme? I'm sure its not the same as our old one. The old UTM Diploma programme was engineered to produce students with the appropriate skills to immediately join the workforce and support the practicing world with very little added training from their firms - thus the emphasis on technical competency.

You've been harping on the Design Matrix in other threads, so I'm sure there is already one for the Diploma programme in UTMKL. What are the learning outcomes for the diploma course?

I've got no issues with the diploma course being integrated with various different kinds of "school of thoughts".. but I like the fact that if  you were to consider under the say.. "Urban" section: you have projects from the early years to the thesis students in there which all share similar emphasis on the urban approach (of course, there will be other approaches as well.. but there is usually a more prominent one)

So, if the Diploma in Semarak is different, can't we just lump in under one "Diploma Semarak" section without any separations for the years? - I was thinking of that earlier.  But now, after consideration, I'm not so sure: I want LUCT students and those from other schools to join in as well (as some have been doing before), so I rather it not be institution specific.   

"Good Architecture" is not an appropriate topic title  if you want something other than the other Design school of thoughts. Are you implying that those school of thoughts cannot achieve Good Architecture?

Worse come to worse, we'll just have a MISC/ general column to put in the projects or discussions we are not sure how to sort.  At least its more generalised.

Can?
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Offline azarimy

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Re: So what is the pedagogy of 2nd year diploma?
« Reply #19 on: February 17, 2007, 04:16:32 PM »
GOSH AZA... never curb to what's going to happen therefore don't allowed it...What are you afraid of? The student will flood other columns, you will give opinions in here, the rest too...isn't that what we do in here AZA? I am merely extending Yuki's Proposal...

Paham sangat ngan abang AZA oi...

what the hell does that got to do with what i said?

seriously, yuri, u really need to read what i've written. no, not just read. understand.

like i said (for the third time), the diploma school CAN be integrated in the other school of thoughts without the need of separating it into its own category. u've been preaching about order and the 'proper way of how thing's should work' havent u?

so this is how i want tanggam to work:

- in the "Design School of Thought" category, i want discussions BASED on topics of interest.
- in the "Subcommunity" category, i want discussions BASED on group/affiliation of people.

in order for u (or anyone) to continue this diploma discussion in DST, i want to know what is the pedagogy of the diploma programme. heck, if u can just give me the learning outcome of the entire programme would be a good start. even better if u could put in the design matrix here. i know basri has one. be a good boy and go get it from him.

as ramesh've said, it's easier to open another group for academic discussion based on specific school programme rather than having the diploma group being oddly placed here. i could lump LUCT's ID discussion there as well. but that defeats the purpose of having tanggam as a design forum. do u understand what i'm saying?

pyan have nailed the entire diploma programme right on the dot. so r u trying to say otherwise? the diploma programme have a prior disposition that they will be trained to become an architect's assistant by default, until they decide to get a degree and become an architect. hence why in the integrated programme (where u, me and everyone else went through), design philosophy is only taught at degree level. it's not even in the design matrix! go look at it.
what gets us into trouble is not what we dont know. it's what we know for sure that just ain't so - mark twain